Meurtre à Grande Vitesse

par Iurius Jeu 24 Oct 2019 - 5:22

Hi to everyone!
I see that there are people here who have solved 'Meurtres sur l'Atlantique' Smile

However, I am currently trying to solve the first game in the series - Meurtre à Grande Vitesse. It is much simpler and shorter, but there are several hard puzzles as well.
I am quite close, but I need some help, please Smile

There are only 8 persons to interrogate (one person at a time up to four testimonies from each one). And then there are the three riddles - opening the locked suitcase, decoding a message (in the same way as 'Geheim!' in 'Meurtres sur l'Atlantique', but with the decoding program already working) and finally finding numbers to call at 'Minitel'.

Actually, I have this game in its Thomson version, but Oric version is the only one that had an additional clue! This one: https://www.oric.org/ftp//games/software/m/meurtre_grande_vitesse/mgv_indice10.gif
I have figured the portion about 'putting K between P and 7TG', but what does the lower part says? It is difficult to read the French handwriting...

In fact, the coded message seems to have some more errors, they are denoted only in the EXL100 manual.
Actually, I have decoded this message, but a few symbols are still wrong. For example, what does § stand for? There is no such key on Thomson/Amstrad/Oric keyboard? Is it '!' ? And what are the two symbols that look like '_' in the second sentence?

And then the 'Minitel' is the only puzzle I can't solve yet... There were some hints as to phone numbers and codes in Amstrad magazine in November 1987 ("le 12, le 16/361339155 (code Pharma ou interpol), le 16/85934075) - I have no idea how to get those numbers from the clues. The third one is probably Bertrand Brocard's home number, but '12' that has to list all the numbers available does not work for me.
And the biggest problem is that I can't find a 'Nom/Code INSEE' to connect to the Interpol. What could that be??? What does 'INSEE' mean in French?

There is also one note I can't figure the meaning of (https://www.oric.org/ftp//games/software/m/meurtre_grande_vitesse/mgv_indice11.jpg), and one more note that is absent in Oric version but present in other versions (attached). Both of them are not indicated by 'xxx' in the game, and the mentioned numbers and codes in fact do not work in the game's Minitel...

Thanks for any help!

Fichiers joints

: Jiji.jpg (19 Ko) Téléchargé 166 fois

par Dom50 Jeu 24 Oct 2019 - 8:26

Hi Iurius,
Welcome to this forum Smile

I'v never played this game but at least, I can help with the clue n°11 .
The sntence is in french is : Le moteur du TGV pèse lourd dans la solution
and the English translation is: The TGV engine weighs heavily in the solution

As usual with Bertrand Brocard games... rather sibylline clue...

I can also help with the meaning of INSEE. It is a french nationnal intitute, and more precisely :
Institut Nationnal de la Statistique et des Etudes Economiques
In English : National Institute of Statistics and Economic Studies

par Iurius Jeu 24 Oct 2019 - 8:31

Thanks, Dom50!

Yes, I have translated that 'TGV engine' message, but I can't understand its meaning. There is no indication in the game as to what does it refer to.

Thanks for that Institut Nationnal de la Statistique et des Etudes Economiques clue as well! But how does it relate to the game? When I call 'Interpol' on Minitel, I have to enter my name (Nom) and Code INSEE (must be some password?), and I do not see any mention of such things neither in the game nor in the physical clues...

And can you please tell what is written in clue 10? Between "P et 7TG" and "Bonne Chance"?

par Dom50 Jeu 24 Oct 2019 - 8:41

sorry for the poor help Smile

The answer to your last question is : " dans tes instructions

par Iurius Jeu 24 Oct 2019 - 8:44

Thanks again!

I have found a clue about that INSEE in Wikipedia: "Each French person receives at birth a national identification number, the "numéro d'inscription au répertoire" (NIR or National Repertory registration), also called a "numéro de sécurité sociale" (or Social Security number). This INSEE number is composed of 13 digits + a two-digit key".
Wow, I did not know that Smile

par Iurius Jeu 24 Oct 2019 - 8:51

Yes, now with that INSEE code I can access the Interpol database Smile

Thanks!!!
Still, there is some problem in finding how to complete the investigation, as there are no any 'tests' like in later 'Meurtres' games.

par Iurius Jeu 24 Oct 2019 - 15:55

OK, I have found a kind of end-game test for 'Meurtre à Grande Vitesse' - it turns out that there was a councours about it (not unlike the one you held about MOTA) announced by 'Théoric' magazine in March and then April 1985!

There were seven questions to be answered, the meaning of 'Le moteur du TGV pèse lourd dans la solution' among them.

The rules promised to reveal the answers (and the winners) on the pages of the June 1985 issue of 'Théoric' - but I see no traces of it neither in June, nor in July, August etc., up to December... Maybe somebody of Oric enthusiasts remember that concours? Could it be that they did not announce the answers because nobody has won?..

par Iurius Mer 30 Oct 2019 - 8:11

OK - I have played four different versions of this game, probably towards the end (Thomson, Amstrad CPC, Commodore 64 and Exelvision100). The puzzles and the texts are somewhat different - but the Oric version seems to be the first (thus it is some kind of 'official' standard).

Unfortunately I can't run it - I get this screen after loading:

Meurtre à Grande Vitesse 696ec384bd67a6869759273654b4ea87

Meurtre à Grande Vitesse 696ec384bd67a6869759273654b4ea87

What could that mean?

par Moonchild Mer 30 Oct 2019 - 15:30

Hello, this is very similar to a copy protection system that says: "Suspense.... Don't tell to your friends the last 47000 bytes of this software", which is the full size of the game I suppose since the oric has 48K of memory.

par Iurius Mer 30 Oct 2019 - 17:12

Moonchild, thanks for the reply!
And what does the last red sentence mean?
I use the mgv.wav from the game's page with Euphoric: I have tried playing the tape again, rewinding it etc., but nothing worked...

par Moonchild Mer 30 Oct 2019 - 17:45

The red sentence mean : "turn on the tape recorder again"

par Symoon Mer 30 Oct 2019 - 23:12

Yes but the "Loading .." seems to indicate that, for a reason or another, the loading hasn't finished.
I gave it a try myself and had no problem with Euphoric (using build 1020 - see that info from the menu screen, F1 key).

par Iurius Jeu 31 Oct 2019 - 9:25

Ah, thanks! It turns out that I was using the 1019 build, and the tape usage is broken there.

With 1020 everything is fine! And the Oric version is indeed the most complete (although it is not the best-looking, you know).
It does have several features not present in any other version:

1. The additional code clue (the one about K between P and 7TG). I have no idea how it was not included with other version, as this information is critical for decoding the message.
2. The copy protection (Controle des Billets)! The table of it was present on the cover of every other version, but it was not used there.
3. Sound effects and music! Only some of the effects could be heard in Thomson et al., but definitely not the music.
4. At the beginning you can choose the starting wagon, while in other versions you always start in Wagon 4 (only in C64 you start in Wagon 3 for some reason).
5. The wagon's layout is also a little bit different: there are two "armoire" in the 1st class, doors to the salon etc. Only traces of it could be seen in C64 version, while others just have an extra WC in place of armoires.
6. The texts and the testimonies are the most complete! For example, the M-lle Voss item 'une page d'agenda' is denoted with 'xxx' in Oric only - somehow everybody forgot to mark it in other versions (and it is a clue).
7. There is an extra puzzle for opening the automatic doors between the wagons!
Meurtre à Grande Vitesse 0b287cfdb786acfb12214cb3599abf51

Meurtre à Grande Vitesse 0b287cfdb786acfb12214cb3599abf51

I have not solved it yet - it seems that the doors are being blocked on some random choice, and you can indeed investigate all the wagons before they are blocked.

Still, it is a very strange game indeed - it would be very nice to find some person who have solved it Smile

Unfortunately, Bertrand Brocard does not answer me about that concours (although he used to write to me before).

Here is some information about the solution I have come to!

Spoiler:

I do hope though that the final solution to this game will be discovered after all Smile

par froggy Jeu 31 Oct 2019 - 10:21

Hey Iurius,

About the minitel 12 stuff "The telephone/Minitel. Maybe not exactly a puzzle, as you can get all the numbers by dialing 12 and waiting for a loooong time for them to show (then again, how to guess it is 12? Maybe it is some French telephone listing code?)".
There is no logical reason here for "12" to me. Therefor, in the 80s' the french telephone directory by operator could be accessed dialing ... 12. When the Minitel appeared, an electronic directory was reachable on this terminal dialing 11 (further on it bacame 3611).

par Iurius Jeu 31 Oct 2019 - 10:29

froggy a écrit:in the 80s' the french telephone directory by operator could be accessed dialing ... 12

Ah, then it is the logical reason after all, thanks! Smile

Probably Bertrand decided not to use separate Minitel directory listing number as 12 displays available numbers both for telephone and for Teletel (including access codes). In Oric you can not only call Bertrand Brocard home telephone number, but also call Cobra Soft via Minitel (it was cut in other versions).

par Cubitus Ven 23 Fév 2024 - 13:28

Hello Iurus

Long time after your last message Smile

I'm an amstrad CPC user
I'm currently playing "Meurtre à grande vitesse". Here are some clues I've found :

1-the coded message :
The error in the listing clue :
oi=ASC(MID$(t$,i,1))-ASC(MID$(c$,j,1))+70
should be
oi=ASC(MID$(t$,i,1))-ASC(MID$(c$,j,1))+75

(Add 75 to ascii character code)
Well... not very usefull because the computer in game has correct crypto code. But ... This was one of the question of the concours Smile

part 1 :
F?ZANHJ1C8ZMHX;0N?XSEG;]"FLPEJDDEEçREOISG9P?HDKPK7TG
DISCRET.ABSOLUE-LIQUIDEZ PERIGNACOUTILSPECIALAUMIAMI

means in english : absolute discretion, kill PERIGNAC, special tool at MIAMI (the hotel in the city of LYON)

Part 2 :
T;JSLHHHç:VQOL;UU7JM?K;UQKNC)U:YCKMJKU?GC
RECUPEREZDOSSIERSACOCHEROUGE-RDVAUFLORIDA

means in english : Come and take the file red bag - meet you at FLORIDA (the hotel in the city of MARSEILLE)
RDV is French acronym for "RENDEZ-VOUS". the 'br*v' word you didn't manage to get Smile

.
--

Just like you I don't know how we can deduce the locked suitcase code :/
The game is written in BASIC. Easy to read. I cheat for this code. (No motivation enough to try all possibility Smile

)

53220 IF O$="6275" THEN OU=1:

si le code saisi = 6275 alors OU=1 (stand for "OUVERT"/OPEN) Very Happy

I'm not proud of this, I would like to understand Smile

par Cubitus Ven 23 Fév 2024 - 14:43

I can't explain the victim's suitcase journey :

A PERIGNAC was in car number 3.
-How did his suitcase reach car number 1 next to his body
-How did the narcotic report (initially in the suitcase I presume) reach the garbage can in car car number 2

Also in this garbage can :
-piece of nail file (the rest of the nest file is on LOUIS PERIGNAC, the victim's brother)
-Perfume smell (LOUIS PERIGNAC or MOZARELLA were there ?)

If someone has some clues Smile

?

par Iurius Ven 23 Fév 2024 - 16:24

Hi Cubitus Smile

Indeed, that was quite a few years ago!

But in 2022 Bertrand Brocard has replied me about this game - sadly he does not remember much about it, but there was indeed the concours successfully done!

Cubitus a écrit:
1-the coded message :
The error in the listing clue :
oi=ASC(MID$(t$,i,1))-ASC(MID$(c$,j,1))+70
should be
oi=ASC(MID$(t$,i,1))-ASC(MID$(c$,j,1))+75

(Add 75 to ascii character code)
Well... not very usefull because the computer in game has correct crypto code. But ... This was one of the question of the concours

Nice! And how did you find it? By checking the program in game?

Cubitus a écrit:
T;JSLHHHç:VQOL;UU7JM?K;UQKNC)U:YCKMJKU?GC
RECUPEREZDOSSIERSACOCHEROUGE-RDVAUFLORIDA

means in english : Come and take the file red bag - meet you at FLORIDA (the hotel in the city of MARSEILLE)
RDV is French acronym for "RENDEZ-VOUS". the 'br*v' word you didn't manage to get .

Great, thanks! So you replace "_" with ":" ? And I thought that was ">" instead of ")".
Well, I did not know about "RDV" acronym anyway Smile

Cubitus a écrit:
Just like you I don't know how we can deduce the locked suitcase code :/
The game is written in BASIC. Easy to read. I cheat for this code. (No motivation enough to try all possibility )

53220 IF O$="6275" THEN OU=1:

si le code saisi = 6275 alors OU=1 (stand for "OUVERT"/OPEN)

I'm not proud of this, I would like to understand

Well, I can help you with this one now!
It is actually one of the riddles - strangely enough only in some versions of the game.
And the solution is what you have found in the error in the listing: 75 instead of 70. So just add 5 to "1720"!

Cubitus a écrit:I can't explain the victim's suitcase journey :
A PERIGNAC was in car number 3.
-How did his suitcase reach car number 1 next to his body
-How did the narcotic report (initially in the suitcase I presume) reach the garbage can in car car number 2

Also in this garbage can :
-piece of nail file (the rest of the nest file is on LOUIS PERIGNAC, the victim's brother)
-Perfume smell (LOUIS PERIGNAC or MOZARELLA were there ?)

And why the garbage can in car 5 contains the victim's ID card ?

If someone has some clues ?

I do

The thief (Mozarella) first stole PERIGNAC's wallet and threw away its contents, and then the murderer (or Mozarella with Louis?) took the suitcase, opened it, threw away the report - and then re-locked it with (in some versions) changed code and placed it near the body.

par Cubitus Ven 23 Fév 2024 - 17:16

Thank you very much. Yes MOZARELLA is pick pocket Smile

Here is my chronology :

After the stop in the city of Lyon around 12 p.m.:
A. PERIGNAC gets up from his seat in car 3 to go to the bar - car 4
12:00 : MOZARELLA offers PERIGNAC a drink. MOZARELLA is a pick-pocket, he steals PERIGNAC's credit card, wallet, ID Card and cash (dollars from his travel to USA and francs - french money before EURO)
12:05 : The controller arrives in car 4 - bar and checks PERIGNAC and MOZARELLA. and leaves towards car 1 on the left (And the controller poisons PERIGNAC with his ring at this time ?)
12:05 p.m.<>12:15 p.m.: Miss VOSS hits a person coming out of the toilet of car 5. She breaks her necklace. we find pearls (physical clue) in the toilet of car 5
The person who comes from the toilet is MOZARELLA who was getting rid of the belongings stolen from PERIGNAC (identity cards, wallet with dollar/franc currency since PERIGNAC was returning from the USA)
MOZARELLA was in the toilet between the bar (car 3) and his seat (car 7)
12:15 : Miss VOSS, A. PERIGNAC's lover, argues with him at the bar. she comes from car 5
Reason: VOSS wants to blackmail PERIGNAC, she has compromising photos of her and PERIGNAC (physical clue : the letter in German + photos found on Miss VOSS. Perignac defends himself because he knows that she is taking neurofix drugs - physical clue of the diary)
12:20 : VOSS and PERIGNAC return to their respective seats
12:35 : MOZARELLA at his seat sees controller car 7 What???!! impossible ? if the controller went towards car 1, towards the left of the bar. Possibility The controller returned to car 7 to hide the poisoned ring in MOZARELLA's bag

par Cubitus Ven 23 Fév 2024 - 17:20

controller returned to car 7 to hide the poisoned ring in MOZARELLA's bag
between 12:35 and 13:00: controler checks car 3 and fails to wake PERIGNAC
Death by sting with a poisoned ring on the neck
13::00 : The bartender calls the doctor who immediately comes in car 1 to examine PERIGNAC’s body
13:00.: The controller transports the body from car 3 to car 1 (and the briefcase?)
13:xx: The doctor returns to car 3 to examine MRS PERIGNAC
LOUIS PERIGNAC goes to pay his respects in front of the body of his brother in car 1 (and takes the victim's briefcase?).
13:xx: LOUIS PERIGNAC is alone with the body (and removes the report from the briefcase?)
13:xx: GARNIER (or LOUIS PERIGNAC?) disposes of the report in the trash can in the toilet of car 2
13:xx: Controler leaves car 1 to car 3 and continues with the doctor
13:15 : The controller and the doctor return to the bar heading towards their seats in car 8 on the right
13:25 : the controller passes at MOZARELLA's seat again in car 7. MOZARELLA asks the controller for the time

par Cubitus Ven 23 Fév 2024 - 17:25

I suppose the Controler is the murderer but ...

Mobile: Recover the file on drug trafficking (American mafia contract)
Evidence:
+When you consult GARNIER on the INTERPOL minitel: It's the controller face Smile

! (without glasses)
+He stays at the MIAMI hotel in Lyon which seems to be one of the 'American' hotels which serve as a cover for drug trafficking
+the green bag is perhaps his because it contains a pay slip in his name: GARNIER
Contains the coded message: DISCREET. ABSOLUTE - LIQUIDATE PERIGNAC SPECIAL TOOL IN MIAMI / RECOVER RED BAG FILE - MEET IN FLORIDA
Contains the pay slip of GARNIER, a criminal according to INTERPOL
=> The killer recovers the weapon in Lyon at the MIAMI hotel, recovers PERIGNAC's file on drug trafficking, gives the file to the sponsor in Marseille at the FLORIDA bar
FLORIDA is a mafia bar which employs the criminal GARNIER
+What was he doing in car 7 at 12:35 (testimony from MOZARELLA). he was supposed to go to the left. Did he retrace his steps in car 7 to hide the ring?

He has a card from the “Miami” hotel with the message: “remember to call the Marignan hotel”
MARIGNAN is the password for the coded killing instructions

par Cubitus Ven 23 Fév 2024 - 17:27

I have still doubt ... Very Happy

-MOZARELLA could be the one who could open the suitcase
-LOUIS PERIGNAC's nails file ... what is the purpose of this evidence

par Cubitus Ven 23 Fév 2024 - 18:34

Iurius a écrit:

Nice! And how did you find it? By checking the program in game?

Yes. I compared the listing evidence code and the "real" code in the game (code used by the game itself when we use the computer in the green bag in car 7)

And I've never found the password by myself
Meurtre à Grande Vitesse 1f605

So I've also written a program by myself. A kind of "reverting crypto" program

- with YOUR result sentence :Discret.Absolue liquide.PerignacoutilspecialauMiami Recupere dossiersacocherougebr*vauFlorida
- and the original text : F?ZANHJ1C8ZHHX;0N?XSEG;${FLPEJD1/EREO1SG9P?HDKPK7TGT;JSLHHH$ WQOL;UU7JM?K;UQKWC)U YCKMJKU?GC

It deduce the possible password

Well that was not very accurate Meurtre à Grande Vitesse 1f602

Because test should be decoded in 2 parts

But ... I finally obtain this result :
MARIGNANMARDGNA[MARIGNAAvLERIGN9+;IGN)NMARIGNANMARI4P[BCNA*K^MGD=[N/TU;S>[JGMG/^.z8UCOJQ8IJ

... Meurtre à Grande Vitesse 1f602

So... I guessed MARIGNAN. Well I calculate MARIGNAN from your result Meurtre à Grande Vitesse 1f602

How did you find the password ?

par Iurius Ven 23 Fév 2024 - 18:44

Well, Garnier is certainly the murderer!
Although everyone else had a motive as well, you know. I first thought that they murdered him all together, Agatha Christie-style Very Happy

But no, not everyone had the possibility! The concours in 1985 proved that the murder happened around 12:55 - the controller visited Wagon 3 and poisoned Perignak with the ring while supposedly "trying to wake him up" - and then called the doctor at 13:00. That 12:35 "evidence" is probably fake, as Mozarella had his own watches.

Still, it is Louis Perignac who stole the report from the suitcase while mourning over his brother's body - probably with the help of Mozarella (who was the only one able to crack locks).

Cubitus a écrit:
So I've also written a program by myself. A kind of "reverting crypto" program

That's some indirect way Smile

Cubitus a écrit:How did you find the password ?

That is the word underlined on the note we found at Garnier!

par Cubitus Ven 23 Fév 2024 - 18:55

Thank you

(Well now it's time for me to try the next one : "Murder on the Atlantic" Smile

)

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